Krucification

The Gray Area Between Art and Exploitation.

9 posts in this topic

A couple of friends and I had a great 3 hour debate/discussion on this pic.

gallery_69_17_137034.png

Now, you see, this is a little bit of controversial area in the Brony community, and has been used to give the community a bad name, (Howard Stern anyone?). Anyways, my point of view is that this is art, where my friend believes that this is exploitation, and is needless. I find this perfectly acceptable, however, he see's it as a type of subject matter that should NEVER be explored, even considering how tame this is compared to other pieces of work I'm sure we've all seen. Claiming that this piece sullies or corrupts one's view of the show itself, thereby destroying the shows innocent nature. That on top of the fact that he considers it within the realm of Beastiality, which I don't believe to be the case.

I want to hear your guys' opinions on this, do you guys consider this piece to be in poor taste, and is the kind of subject matter that should never be explored in this community?

Or do you think that this work is perfectly fine, and shouldn't warrant such negativity.

Please, *encouraging push* discuss discuss....

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There isn't an area between art and exploitation.

They are two different things. Something can be both.

From Miriam Webster:

Art: the conscious use of skill and creative imagination especially in the production of aesthetic objects; also: works so produced

Exploit: to make use of meanly or unfairly for one's own advantage

It's art. If it's a drawing, animation, etc., by default it's art.

Whether it is exploitation is a different matter.

Saying "This isn't art, it's exploitation." makes as much sense as saying "This isn't a DVD, it's a porno."

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I DIDN'T READ ANY OF THE TEXT BUT THAT IS HOT, POST MORE PLZ

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Partially relevant thread I made.

The tl;dr of it is me basically expressing how I don't think there is anything wrong with a sexual interest in these characters--How it isn't bestiality in the least. And then asking others their feelings on the subject. If we want to have a discussion on specifically that, I'm more than willing to oblige--I've spent a ton of time thinking on the subject and I have plenty to say. But I'm not sure if that's the focus of this thread. Because I simply don't think there is anything wrong at all with a sexual attraction to Equestrian ponies, I'm going broaden my approach on this subject to include any and all art that is erotic in nature. Because to me, there is no ethical difference between Pony R34 and saucy/ecchi/hentai/porn.

Sex is a natural human craving--and suppressing it is unhealthy. Most people are going to develop sexual attraction for anything that meets certain criteria (which is unique for each person). This is just going to happen. So, I ask, why is it bad to draw art of it? Art of any form is and always has been the ultimate expression of the human soul and emotion. Lust is just an emotion, just like Anger, Sadness, and Love. So why do people shun it?

Yes, it's sexy art of characters. If you don't like it, that's fine. But don't hate on it's existence.

Ugh, I'm not sure if I'm being very concise right now. Going stop here and come back later when my mind isn't so distracted.

I DIDN'T READ ANY OF THE TEXT BUT THAT IS HOT, POST MORE PLZ

I can help you with that. ;)

>_>

<_<

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>Ponies not wearing clothes

>Yeah OK

>Ponies wearing extremely loose fitting clothing

>AJDRASLDKFHKSDFHEXPLOTATIONLWEUIIFHLWEIFHLAIEWUFILAWHFU

Logic

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There isn't an area between art and exploitation.

They are two different things. Something can be both.

From Miriam Webster:

Art: the conscious use of skill and creative imagination especially in the production of aesthetic objects; also: works so produced

Exploit: to make use of meanly or unfairly for one's own advantage

It's art. If it's a drawing, animation, etc., by default it's art.

Whether it is exploitation is a different matter.

Saying "This isn't art, it's exploitation." makes as much sense as saying "This isn't a DVD, it's a porno."

Ya see, that is exactly how I see it. I honestly don't know how he came up with the opinion that that it must be one or the other. I probably should have addressed that. In any case, I would like to hear your opinion on whether or not you think it exploits anything.

Partially relevant thread I made.

The tl;dr of it is me basically expressing how I don't think there is anything wrong with a sexual interest in these characters--How it isn't bestiality in the least. And then asking others their feelings on the subject. If we want to have a discussion on specifically that, I'm more than willing to oblige--I've spent a ton of time thinking on the subject and I have plenty to say. But I'm not sure if that's the focus of this thread. Because I simply don't think there is anything wrong at all with a sexual attraction to Equestrian ponies, I'm going broaden my approach on this subject to include any and all art that is erotic in nature. Because to me, there is no ethical difference between Pony R34 and saucy/ecchi/hentai/porn.

Sex is a natural human craving--and suppressing it is unhealthy. Most people are going to develop sexual attraction for anything that meets certain criteria (which is unique for each person). This is just going to happen. So, I ask, why is it bad to draw art of it? Art of any form is and always has been the ultimate expression of the human soul and emotion. Lust is just an emotion, just like Anger, Sadness, and Love. So why do people shun it?

Yes, it's sexy art of characters. If you don't like it, that's fine. But don't hate on it's existence.

Ugh, I'm not sure if I'm being very concise right now. Going stop here and come back later when my mind isn't so distracted.

I DIDN'T READ ANY OF THE TEXT BUT THAT IS HOT, POST MORE PLZ

I can help you with that. ;)

>_>

<_<

I welcome all kinds of discussion on the topic, honestly. What I keep saying is that something such as this is just an exploration of the more mature side of the MLP universe, which has never, nor will ever be touched upon in the show. However, the counterargument he gives is that exploration for the sake of exploration is pointless and needless, that it needs to have a discernible and justifiable purpose to explore such an area. I do agree with you that this is far from Bestiality, as well as the fact that suppressing such an essential part of a human being is both unhealthy and overall negative to their well-being.

I can understand his worry that exploring such material can somehow ruin the innocence of the show itself, however, I really don't think he has anything to worry about.

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>Ponies not wearing clothes

>Yeah OK

>Ponies wearing extremely loose fitting clothing

>AJDRASLDKFHKSDFHEXPLOTATIONLWEUIIFHLWEIFHLAIEWUFILAWHFU

Logic

It's more of the implication of the overall scene which seems to rustle his jimmies.

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I don't think I would call it exploitation per se.

The best example of exploitation in the arts I can think of is probly the 70's blacksploitation films.

Basically, to exploit something, especially in art, IMO, you need to be profitting off of something negative or unfairly profiting off of something that was largely the work of someone else.

It's difficult to find a really good example that isnt blatant art theft. I cite the blacksploitation films because they are generally full of stereotypes from start to finish.

Are works of exploitation bad? Not neccessarily. There are really so many ways to exploit a work that it's hard to describe it in any general terms. It's probly a matter best decided on a case-by-case level.

Really any works related to ponies that are sold could be considered exploitation. Unlicensed t-shirts, drawings, fan comics, that one comic you-know-the-one.

If you really stretch the definition of the word, any fanart could be viewed as exploitation, as it could be argued that works made off of copyrighted characters still give an advantage to the artists making them, by reputation at least.

I'll sum up, as I don't know where I'm going with this anymore...

Is exploitation bad? Not always.

Is R34, ponysauce, or fanart/fanfiction exploitation? Maybe, depending on your personal take on exploitation. It's such a vague definition in this usage it can be hard to define on more than a personal level. Even harder to place a group of works into a category undr such a definition.

My 2 bits.

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I don't think I would call it exploitation per se.

The best example of exploitation in the arts I can think of is probly the 70's blacksploitation films.

Basically, to exploit something, especially in art, IMO, you need to be profitting off of something negative or unfairly profiting off of something that was largely the work of someone else.

It's difficult to find a really good example that isnt blatant art theft. I cite the blacksploitation films because they are generally full of stereotypes from start to finish.

Are works of exploitation bad? Not neccessarily. There are really so many ways to exploit a work that it's hard to describe it in any general terms. It's probly a matter best decided on a case-by-case level.

Really any works related to ponies that are sold could be considered exploitation. Unlicensed t-shirts, drawings, fan comics, that one comic you-know-the-one.

If you really stretch the definition of the word, any fanart could be viewed as exploitation, as it could be argued that works made off of copyrighted characters still give an advantage to the artists making them, by reputation at least.

I'll sum up, as I don't know where I'm going with this anymore...

Is exploitation bad? Not always.

Is R34, ponysauce, or fanart/fanfiction exploitation? Maybe, depending on your personal take on exploitation. It's such a vague definition in this usage it can be hard to define on more than a personal level. Even harder to place a group of works into a category under such a definition.

My 2 bits.

Nicely said. I wish I had thought of that when I was talking with him haha.

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